ZitatPirelli to make hard tyre more durable 2013 F1 season April 25, 2013 at 9:10 am by Keith Collantine 98 comments
Pirelli hard tyre, Sepang, 2013Pirelli have announced they will change the compound of their hard tyre from the next race in Spain.
F1′s official tyre supplier says the new hard tyre will be similar in construction to that used last year,
Pirelli motorsport director Paul Hembery said: “After evaluating tyre performance over the balance of the first four races, we took the decision – in consultation with all of the teams – to change the hard compound from Spain onwards, as we did in Barcelona two years ago when we also introduced a new hard tyre for the rest of the season.”
“This latest version of the hard compound is much closer to the 2012 tyre, with the aim of giving the teams more opportunity to run a wider range of strategies in combination with the other compounds, which remain unchanged.”
Although the aggressiveness of Pirelli’s 2013 tyres had been criticised by some teams, such as Red Bull, Pirelli claim the majority of teams support their choice of compounds.
The new hard tyre will be used for the first time at the next round, the Spanish Grand Prix at the Circuit de Catalunya, where it has been allocated along with the medium tyre.
Pirelli will bring the soft and super-soft tyres for Monaco, and the super-soft and medium tyres for Canada.
ZitatRäikkönen's experience from tires gets praisal from Pirelli's manager
F1 | Turun Sanomat 26.4.2013 10:07
Behind the scenes on the F1-paddock both Kimi Räikkönen and Fernando Alonso are praised of being best in managing Pirelli's tires.
Both are claimed to be able to drive all 60 laps in a race in a slightly different way in order to stress the tires in the least consuming way.
Heroic stories aside - does Paul Hembery from Pirelli also agree that this duo is better than the others?
– To be honest there is a group in the starting grid who are clearly the best when it comes to managing tires. The biggest talents wouldn't be great drivers if that wouldn't be the case. It has been like that during different eras also. Every champion is also very good with tires. They are champions for a good reason, Hembery says.
– But since you ask about Kimi, he has had a good season this far which proves that he has managed his tires really well. Kimi is always on the podium and he has a car that is competitive on all tracks this season - and it's a great thing especially from Finland's perspective, Hembery told the Finnish reporter.
Harder compound will be more harder
Pirelli announced on Thursday that they will change their hardest compound starting from Spain GP and bring it closer to last year's compound, which was softened for this year.
This way the Italian team prepares to secure their own position, since the compounds from the first season could have flopped big time on Montmelo track where the left front tire will be under toughest strain.
By changing the harder compound Pirelli gave up in a way and admitted that they don't have a hard enough compound for a straining track like Barcelona.
Whereas most drivers and teams - Red Bull in the frontier - have harshly critisized Pirelli's tire policy as less driver-friendly, Räikkönen again has taken the side of Hembery's troops. Kimi has wondered why the rest are crying when F1 has had similar times before also when you couldn't drive flat out during the whole race.
Then what does Hembery think when he got Räikkönen on his side?
– To be honest, Kimi is a very practictal top driver - just like most team managers are also. They all have the same tires and they understand that if they don't win, then it's not because of the tire supplier, it's because of what they do with the tires. Maybe they don't like what they have to do, but then again the challenge is the same for everyone.
– If you want to win then you have to make sure that the tire is working. This is something that Kimi has understood completely, Hembery said.
The last stint is like from a different planet
Räikkönen has reminded that if they would race with full tanks on previous tires the situation would be just the same as it is today.
– The amound of fuel decides a lot how you can use tires. When you look at the race after the last pitstops with new tires and lighter fuel loads, the speed is like from a different planet, Hembery reminds.
Critisized Hembery is is confused over how short memory people in F1 really have.
– We could bring so hard compounds to each race that tires would have less significance on the results. But then the same that happened a few years ago would happen again, people would lose their interest because races would become too boring. It seems like in three years people have forgotten all together just how boring the races used to be.
– We have found out that teams and fans love these races when you don't know who will win the race when it starts. This was exactly our goal, Hembery assures.
Pirelli announced their tire compounds for the next three races. 12.5. In Spain they will drive with the two harderst compounds, 26.5. in Monaco with the two softest compounds and 9.6. in Canada with supersoft and mediumhard compounds.
ZitatF1 : Marko sees Lotus and not Ferrari as true challengers for 2013 Formula 1 title Wednesday, 24 April 2013 11:10
Lotus tougher challenger than Ferrari says Marko - According to Dr. Helmut Marko, the Lotus F1 Team is a bigger challenger to Red Bull's Formula One championship hopes in 2013 than Ferrari.
Red Bull and Sebastian Vettel are leading Lotus and Kimi Raikkonen in both the constructors' and drivers' world championships after the first four 'flyaway' races.
But it might be argued that the bulk of Ferrari's deficit is because of Fernando Alonso's crash in Malaysia and malfunctioning DRS rear wing flap in Bahrain.
Asked, however, if Red Bull expected Lotus' Raikkonen to be challenging so hard in 2013, Marko told Kleine Zeitung newspaper: "We've known for a long time that they will be maybe the toughest opponents.
"At the moment we fear Lotus more than we do Ferrari," he insisted.
Asked if he really thinks Lotus will be a tougher challenger than Ferrari all season, Marko answered: "At the moment it looks like it.
"But there's only been four races, and we know that things can change.
"Actually, what is making the Lotus so quick in the races is a mystery to us."
Marko would not comment on the speculation the Enstone based team has perfected an hydraulically controlled form of legal 'active suspension'.
But Red Bull is keeping an eye on Lotus for another reason.
Finn Raikkonen, the 2007 world champion and former McLaren and Ferrari driver, has been strongly linked with the race seat currently occupied by Mark Webber for 2014.
Asked if there is anything new to say on that topic, Marko insisted: "No.
"I've said it several times. We make our driver decisions before August, and that will be the case this year too."
I can't agree with Dr Marko here. As much as I'd like to be wrong for Kimi's sake, Ferrari has the best car on the grid in my opinion. Red bull will face a tough challenge if Ferrari retains their 2012 reliability. It seems only 3 teams are capable of race victory at the moment. As a result, I don't anticipate a stiff challenge from non-front running teams. Whereas we had 7 race winners from 7 GP's to start the season in 2012, that number could only be 3 after 7 GP's this year. This will allow Fernando to Make a dent into Vettel's lead.
ZitatMarko calling for further tyre changes 30 April 2013
Helmut Marko, advisor to reigning World Champions Red Bull, has reiterated his dissatisfaction at the current tyre situation in Formula 1, with the 70-year-old yearning for Pirelli to overhaul its "restrictive" compounds for the remainder of the 2013 season.
The Italian tyre manufacturer came under massive pressure to change its rubber during the first four flyaway weekends, but it stood firm in a recent meeting and has only opted to tweak its Hard compound for next month's Spanish Grand Prix.
"We want a tyre that does not restrict our potential," Marko told a group of journalists at the Red Bull Ring in Austria. "It ought to be that you can get the maximum out of the car. Currently it is a compromise, the car has to be adjusted to minimise pit-stops.
"We have two top drivers, which is not cheap. Then you have to tell them not to drive flat out through certain corners and that is not easy. This distorts competition."
Although the tyre situation continues to leave Red Bull feeling aggrieved, the team holds a lead of 16 points over nearest rivals Lotus in the Constructors' standings.
It's not Red Bull's fault. They want to push the car to the limit. Isn't that what Formula 1 is all about? Engineers producing a 'toy' which takes the limits of physics to the maximum?
You're an engineer. So how would you like it if someone told you to 'hold back' your knowledge because the corporation doesn't want you to push your design to the limit? Wouldn't you be frustrated? Especially if your design - which was always superior the competition - could become inferior because of the corporate limits? " title="huh" />
Red Bull are in Formula 1 to win. They don't have the largest budget on the grid to produce a moving advertisement on F1 circuits..
and others don't want to push to the limit? with how F1 is atm, that overtaking is difficult, no refueling and so on.. with also durable tyres it would be a boring race with just one stop and RB driving from pole to win. does anybody want that? no, and that's why they wanted Pirelli to make such tyres. and they did. and it's the same for everybody. they could test the tyres, they knew how it will be so it's only their fault if they have build a car which is fast but destroys the tyres. and btw they have won 2 times of 4 races, it can't be that bad " title="roll" /> and really it's like they are the only ones who suffer from it. no, they are just the only ones who complain all the time. other teams reacted to it and just make the best with those tyres. what does all the whining help? do they really think Pirelli would change it? that would be totally unfair.
i'm sorry Sonny, but i fully agree with miezi's way of thinking. in engineering we have our data, our constraints, we make educated assumptions and look for the optimum solution using every intelligent trick we can find. so, everybody knew what the tyres were like....so, the design should be based on that constraint...many times there are too many constraints. our job is to make our best under these constraints ( being on the limits of these constraints is a good thing though h" title="hih" /> ) and also with the lowest possible budget. what if now some other team which has problems with some other rule, starts complaining? and arent any changes purely unfair to the other teams who designed their cars to work under the given conditions?
Zitat von Olgai'm sorry Sonny, but i fully agree with miezi's way of thinking. in engineering we have our data, our constraints, we make educated assumptions and look for the optimum solution using every intelligent trick we can find. so, everybody knew what the tyres were like....so, the design should be based on that constraint...many times there are too many constraints. our job is to make our best under these constraints ( being on the limits of these constraints is a good thing though ) and also with the lowest possible budget. what if now some other team which has problems with some other rule, starts complaining? and arent any changes purely unfair to the other teams who designed their cars to work under the given conditions?
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And thats what I have a test on today.
Maximise( or minimise ) the objective function subject to the constraints given
Zitat von miezicatand others don't want to push to the limit? with how F1 is atm, that overtaking is difficult, no refueling and so on.. with also durable tyres it would be a boring race with just one stop and RB driving from pole to win. does anybody want that?
Sure others want to push to the limit. But can others push to the same "limit" in the corners as the Red Bull? We don't know for sure, but it's likely that the Red Bull produces the most downforce and therefore has a different "limit" than other teams in these situations. Is asking Pirelli to go this far with the tyres an admission from the FIA that they are unsure how to eliminate Red Bull's aero advantage?
Why should the tyres have to stop Red Bull from pole and/or race victory? Can't the FIA or TWG come up with anything? If that's the true mission of Pirelli, why don't they come out and say it? I understand one team dominating the sport isn't good for viewer interest. And I also understand that the rules have been tweaked in the past to hopefully crown a new champion (i.e. Ferrari in 2000's).
But when is enough truly enough? Some teams had to make 4 pit stops for a race distance. That's using up the entire allotment of tyres for Sunday. On the hardest two compound tyres supplied by Pirelli!
Zitat von miezicat no, and that's why they wanted Pirelli to make such tyres. and they did. and it's the same for everybody. they could test the tyres, they knew how it will be so it's only their fault if they have build a car which is fast but destroys the tyres. and btw they have won 2 times of 4 races, it can't be that bad and really it's like they are the only ones who suffer from it. no, they are just the only ones who complain all the time. other teams reacted to it and just make the best with those tyres. what does all the whining help? do they really think Pirelli would change it? that would be totally unfair.
You claim it's unfair to ask Pirelli to change the compounds mid-season. But why were the Pirelli tyres changed in the first place? What was the impetus for Pirelli taking 'another step' in their tyres from 2012 to 2013? If the answer is truly to slow-down Red Bull and/or prevent Red Bull from another title, isn't THAT unfair? If your answer is to improve the 'show' of Formula 1, that's another topic (and one I also am not a fan of).
I personally think Red Bull are complaining because they feel they are the benchmark in relation to how much downforce each car is capable of producing, and thus the quickest car on the grid. I believe they also feel that they are unable to exploit the cars true potential due to the high deg rates of the tyres. Because their car is being held back from reaching its limit, Red Bull is at risk of throwing away points it wouldn't otherwise throw away (say if 2012 tyres were bolted to the car). And other teams may be driving to their limit and challenging a team which is incapable of reaching theirs.. I understand it's the same for everyone on the grid. But it's in the spirit of competition which they feel 'threatened.' Ferrari seem to have found a very good balance with the tyres which allows them to be strong in qualifying and even stronger in the race. The F138 is arguably the best package so far in 2013. Due to being unable to exploit their cars full potential and having very strong opposition, you hear the "whining."
Zitat von SonnyIt's not Red Bull's fault. They want to push the car to the limit. Isn't that what Formula 1 is all about? Engineers producing a 'toy' which takes the limits of physics to the maximum?
You're an engineer. So how would you like it if someone told you to 'hold back' your knowledge because the corporation doesn't want you to push your design to the limit? Wouldn't you be frustrated? Especially if your design - which was always superior the competition - could become inferior because of the corporate limits?
F1 is about pushing to the limits within the rules. Red Bull dont care about the overall show in F1 they just want to come out on top. And they are actually on top currently. If they feel that their car cant be pushed to the limits within the rules then it is up to them to design their car more to the limits. Everyone knew the rules since last year, everyone has the same challenges.
F1 has always been more about compromise then anything else. If you design a car with oversteer it will be an advantage at certain places and a disadvantage at others, if you design a car with more understeer then it will have an advantage and disadvantage on other places. If you setup your car with high downforce it will be better in the corners but you will lose out on the straights, if you setup your car with low downforce you will be fast on the straights but lack traction and grip in the slow corners. If your suspension settings are stiff you will lift your tyres off the track at some corners and lose contact with the track, if your suspension setting are to soft then you might bottom out on the straights. If you concentrate to much on being fast in qualifying then might end up being slower in the race. Every lap a driver does is compromised in some way, if he concentrates on being fast in certain sections and corners, then he will lose time in other sections.
F1 has never just been about driving around flat out, and it is the same for every other motorsport. Even rally where a driver is suppose to go as fast as possible in a predetermined space, are not immune to this. Even there a driver goes slower on purpose at times. Racing has always been tactical game.
From a team's point of view you want as much speed available as possible but you also have to know how to apply this speed. Mclaren was the fastest car last year at many stages, but they just didn't apply their advantage correctly. It is the same situation with the rules, everyone has the same rules and they have to interpret and apply them to the best of their abilities and come up with a package that works under those rules. Every single era of F1 has had their own challenges, were drivers couldn't always just go as fast as possible. In some of the previous eras you always had to safe your equipment as the cars were prone to breaking down, or there often wasn't enough fuel in the cars to last the whole race so they had to drive slower. Even in the refueling era with "flat out" stints, there were always the same compromises. If you wanted to do a one stop strategy for example then you had to look after your tyres and conserve your fuel. Even if you weren't on a one stop strategy drivers often tried to safe fuel, drive conservatively to go a few laps longer, and do one fast lap at the end of a stint before pitting. Even then they were never just going flat out. On the last stint drivers always used to drive slowly to conserve their equipment for the next race. It is a big fallacy that drivers have been in a position to just go flat out for the whole race. The teams have always received a new set of parameters every year and it is up to them to work out the best compromise within that set of parameters they are given.
One analogy I can think of is using cricket. If you know you are set to play a test match series in India, then you will have to make sure that you include a few good spin bowlers. You dont go to India with just a bunch of fast bowlers and start moaning about the pitches. The onus is on you to work out the best solution with what you are given. It is only in F1 where there is regularly a problem with understanding this concept.
If Red Bull feels that they are not doing well enough within the rules, or that they aren't going fast enough then it is up to them to design a car that will do better under the rules.
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